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Re: hai guyz!

Postby soundwave106 » Tue Sep 11, 2018 2:22 pm

topcat wrote:But it may be a matter of demographics, maybe they are spending more money than other genres.


Pretty much the top selling music in the US boils down to scenes like:
(*) Hip hop / R&B (the majority)
(*) Stadium EDM
(*) Teen pop and a handful of other pop bands like Maroon 5
(*) "Big indie" (bands like Imagine Dragons which really hit the charts too much to be called "indie pop" anymore)
(*) Modern country music (your Florida Georgia line type -- basically today's 80s hair metal / arena rock scene with a few fiddles and a Southern drawl)

Aside from country music, most of these range from "heavy electronic" to "all electronic" (especially the hip hop / EDM side) and probably much of this is ITB these days.

Also, a lot of the "underground" scenes and trends involve electronic dance (your dubsteps and chillsteps and future bass and chillwave and synthwave and trap and reggeaton and whatnot) and a lot of *this* also is all ITB electronic.

Native Instruments is pretty huge in some of these genres. Massive for instance was big enough of a sound in dubstep for the wavetable "Modern Talking" in it to become a cliche in the field. It makes sense to me for NI to target the EDM market in their ads.

You won't say that same sort of ad for, say, Spectrasonics Omnisphere since that software tends to target the film and TV composer folks.

"Alternative / indie rock" is probably the biggest genre that sometimes does use hardware synths and sometimes does play on them live at the moment, so in contrast, when you, say, see Moog ads (or other hardware synth companies), they tend to target the hipster segment if they target anything.
Last edited by soundwave106 on Tue Sep 11, 2018 3:17 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: hai guyz!

Postby MetroSonus » Tue Sep 11, 2018 2:46 pm

I kinda get what he's saying though.. up through the 90's, everyone actually played instruments, had garage bands, maybe even played out somewhere. Cover bands were still a thing and they made enough money off of them to live.

Then sony acid hit and since, we've seen an explosion of cheap, tiny, controllers that were fueled by pipe dreams of sampling a record and banging out a hit in a star bucks. And look at our genre though, every thing is cheap, tiny toys and there's an overwhelming majority of "me too" noisy, crappy music that people justify as art. but that always comes and goes in waves.

From anecdotal evidence, i'd say most of your instrument players are older guys who have been doing it since the 80's and 90's. You're right though, it's the push in electronic hip hop and other genres over all, but doesn't that make sense too? 1 dude on a computer can write and produce 10 bands. I think it's about dollar signs to record companies more than anything else. I hate to say it too, but it's easier to fake being a producer to some girl you're trying too woo by pressing a pad on a controller and playing a loop you dug out of a pack rather than spending a few years learning to play guitar. :freak:

times change I guess dudes. :snax:

But yes, NI is targeting the EDM crowd. The ads for East West and other composer suites are vastly different.

Top cat, :wave: I know, I'm sorry you've been through some stuff. I think we all have the last few years. As long as I'm still alive, this place will be open. I saw too many forum takeovers and crashes and I honestly didn't want to lose touch with all of the friends I had made over the years.

We joke around, but had we all met in highschool, we would have made some legendary, prog rock, D&D super nerd group or something :lol:
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Re: hai guyz!

Postby soundwave106 » Tue Sep 11, 2018 4:01 pm

MetroSonus wrote:I kinda get what he's saying though.. up through the 90's, everyone actually played instruments, had garage bands, maybe even played out somewhere. Cover bands were still a thing and they made enough money off of them to live.


Well, yeah. But laptops became cheap. The Interwebs and da piratez made electronic music the most cost effective way to make music. It's the modern pawn shop guitar.

As far as people playing instruments goes, though, one thing I don't think has helped at all is that today's society has pretty much de-valued arts education in general. Music education has pretty much been decimated across the board. So nowadays, the routes to learn to play completely relies on either self-teaching yourself or hire expensive tutors.

One of the main interfaces of the synth has traditionally been the piano, and IMHO piano is a little bit harder instrument to pick up to the point where you "sound competent". (Electric guitar, as a contrast has the convenient "barre E" and "barre A" chords, and the power chord. You still need time to pick it up of course, but you can do a lot with just a few fingerings. Consequently this is the basis of punk and garage rock.)

The other traditional interface of the synth has been pads, which have been used in beat-making genres since forever. Again, with pre-recorded loops and all of the helpers out there, I think it's pretty easy to pick up beat making to the point where you "sound competent". (In all cases of course mastery is tough.) Anyways it's not surprising that side dominates things.

The other thing lost with the demise of music education is that you start to get disconnected from some of the more theoretical things you can think about harmony, melody, rhythm, and whatnot. While pop music is never going to completely be academic, I feel that the lack of this in schools may contribute to some of the reasons why pop music is getting worse and more disposable. (And by worse I mean: more repetitive, over-focused on the rhythm (very little harmony / melody), and more anti-social / angry boasting / ego stroking crap in the lyrics that no one will care about in five years. Simple is fine, but it seems like the pendulum has swung so far in pop that there is relatively few pop music pieces I could reasonably call "complex" in scope. A situation very unlike, say, 1970s pop, which had plenty of crap no one remembers, but plenty of gems that still get played today.)
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Re: hai guyz!

Postby Purity_Control » Tue Sep 11, 2018 5:23 pm

Dunno how it was elsewhere, but in the UK Top of the Pops (weekly chart TV show) was huge in the 70s and well into the 80s, if you were a kind then it was something you watched with your parents.

Only time I hear pop music these days is at the gym, dunno what's going on but it seems to be the same shit recycled for almost the last decade. :freak:
"To be honest with you, I just assumed it was another symptom of Taren Capel being as mad as a bicycle."
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Re: hai guyz!

Postby ElectricPuppy » Tue Sep 11, 2018 8:52 pm

Funny you should mention D&D. Teh Wife and I are thinking of starting up a campaign and inviting some friends. We haven't played D&D since high school. :lol:
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Re: hai guyz!

Postby MetroSonus » Wed Sep 12, 2018 12:21 pm

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Re: hai guyz!

Postby MetroSonus » Wed Sep 12, 2018 12:30 pm

ElectricPuppy wrote:Funny you should mention D&D. Teh Wife and I are thinking of starting up a campaign and inviting some friends. We haven't played D&D since high school. :lol:


Yeah I miss stuff like that.. I haven't played since college.. my son is always telling me how I used to be cool :eyes: :lol:

Oh did i tell you guys the story of how I had a screw driver he was looking for? Years ago, my wife worked part time at night and the boy was but a wee lad and went to bed around 7:30-8. For some reason, I got into old nintendo stuff and playing emulators. I was fixing and cleaning stuff and I had to buy one of those Nintendo specific 3 bladed phillips head type screw drivers.

Many moons pass and now my son is a nintendo freak. He's been needing one of those screw drivers (seriously this kid is a wiz with stuff.. I'd love to send him to suit to apprentice but, no, he can't be cool and like synthesizers :eyes: :lol: ) anyway.. Im working on something and need a small screw driver and I start getting mad because I don't know why it won't work. My son realizes it's a tri wing and freaks the hell out. :lol: You had one the whole time?! Why didn't I remember?! (I'm old.. :idk: ) Why can't I like Nintendo stuff now?

I'd honestly like to rebuild my multi media pc, add some emulators and stuff. I don't just want to get too distracted right now with school and other stuff going on. And you can only play games so much.. at least I can or can't.

D&D would be cool.. or some old school mechwarrior
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Re: hai guyz!

Postby MetroSonus » Wed Sep 12, 2018 12:35 pm

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Re: hai guyz!

Postby MetroSonus » Wed Sep 12, 2018 12:42 pm

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Re: hai guyz!

Postby MetroSonus » Wed Sep 12, 2018 12:46 pm

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I actually do like toast :lol: we have refried beans, right?
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Re: hai guyz!

Postby ClavAnother » Wed Sep 12, 2018 3:55 pm

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Re: hai guyz!

Postby topcat » Wed Sep 12, 2018 5:53 pm

There is still hope the future of music will be ok: Top ten for 2017

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Re: hai guyz!

Postby MetroSonus » Thu Sep 13, 2018 1:11 pm

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Re: hai guyz!

Postby MetroSonus » Thu Sep 13, 2018 1:17 pm

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Re: hai guyz!

Postby MetroSonus » Thu Sep 13, 2018 1:21 pm

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Re: hai guyz!

Postby MetroSonus » Thu Sep 13, 2018 5:15 pm

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shampoo = body wash

bodywash =/= shampoo

seriously.. buy a giant family sized suave shampoo and use it for everything. It's teh same crap as body wash minus scent and other crap. I have sensitive skin and I can't use any of it anyway lol and cheaper
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Re: hai guyz!

Postby ElectricPuppy » Fri Sep 14, 2018 2:40 pm

lol and cheaper.

Personally I'm a fan of artisanal salt scrubs. It doesn't strip off my seasoning like soap can.
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Re: hai guyz!

Postby gregwar » Sat Sep 15, 2018 2:12 am

@topcat, i’m sorry to hear that does sound difficult.

the best way to avoid distractions with any form of electric music production is to have a minimal set up. i’ve had large studios with dozens of pieces of gear, mixers, hardware effects, etc and it all results in less getting done and more tech headaches.

if you like bands and live shows with keyboard players that’s cool it’s just a different style of music. i played in metal bands and it was fun! yes, pop music is incestuous and derivative but so is everything.

still, it may be harder than we think to make proper edm and pop bangers. i started watching pensado’s place a few years ago and mixing rap music is very difficult. too bad a lot of the rappers suck compared to the producers and mixers lol
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Re: hai guyz!

Postby Purity_Control » Sat Sep 15, 2018 12:51 pm



:facepalm:
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Re: hai guyz!

Postby Purity_Control » Sat Sep 15, 2018 12:53 pm

gregwar wrote:@topcat, i’m sorry to hear that does sound difficult.

the best way to avoid distractions with any form of electric music production is to have a minimal set up. i’ve had large studios with dozens of pieces of gear, mixers, hardware effects, etc and it all results in less getting done and more tech headaches.

if you like bands and live shows with keyboard players that’s cool it’s just a different style of music. i played in metal bands and it was fun! yes, pop music is incestuous and derivative but so is everything.

still, it may be harder than we think to make proper edm and pop bangers. i started watching pensado’s place a few years ago and mixing rap music is very difficult. too bad a lot of the rappers suck compared to the producers and mixers lol


Couldn't agree with this more, too much kit seems to end with almost permanent issues of some kind or another, even limiting yourself to one or two boards and a couple of other bits sat around really makes a difference.

It also helps me a lot to have the digital piano in the front room, for when I want to practice or play but don't have a lot of time or just need a break from the studio.
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